Some time ago I discovered Stephan Gerber’s website http://www.trinitaet.com/index.php. I was particularly interested in the fifty articles by Kermit Zarley. I agree with Kermit Zarley on the Trinity. It is the greatest heresy of Christianity. I disagree with his comments on pre-existence and incarnation.
In a supplement to an email to Stephan Gerber, I would like to inform you of the following:
I have objections to pre-existence and incarnation. I think that these two terms should not be linked to the question of God (was Jesus GOD?). According to my belief, the following biblical references point to the pre-existence of Jesus as the Son of God:
(Source: New American Standard Bible (NASB)
1 Corinthians 8.6
6 yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things and we exist for Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him.
[6 So for us there is a God a, father b, of whom all things are c and we towards him, and a Lord, Jesus Christ d, through whom all things are e and we through him. a) Chap. 12.6; Isa 45:14; Joh 17.3 b) Eph 4.6 c) Chap. 11.12; Acts 17.25; Rom 11.36 d) Chap. 12.5; Lk 2.11; Eph 4.5 e) Joh 1.3)][ ] These brackets mean Google translator.
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Col. 1, 15-23
15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation.
[15 He is the image of the invisible God a, the firstborn b of all creation c. a) Jn 12:45; 2 Corinthians 4.4 b) V. 18 c) Heb 1.6]16 For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through Him and for Him.
[16 For in him A everything was created in heaven and on earth a, the visible and the invisible, be they thrones or lordships or powers or powers: everything was created by him and towards him b; A) i.e. in the power of his person a) Joh 1,3,10 b) Rom 11,36]17 He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together.
[17 and above all he is a, and everything through him is b. a) Prov 8.25-27; Mi 5.1; Rev 3.14; Jn 8.58; 17.5 b) Heb 1.3]18 He is also head of the body, the church; and He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, so that He Himself will come to have first place in everything.
[18 And he is the head of the body a, the community Ab. He is the beginning, the firstborn c from the dead d, so that he has priority in everything; A) or Assembly a) Chap. 2.19 b) Eph 1.22.23 c) Rom 8.29 d) Acts 26.23; 1 Cor 15.20; Rev 1.5]19 For it was the Father’s good pleasure for all the fullness to dwell in Him,
[19 for all the abundance A liked living in it a A) d.i. according to chap. 2,9: the deity a) chap. 2.9]20 and through Him to reconcile all things to Himself, having made peace through the blood of His cross; through Him, I say, whether things on earth or things in heaven.
[20 and through him to reconcile everything with himself A – by B making peace through the blood of his cross a – through him, be it what is on earth or what is in heaven b. A) w. towards him B) or after a) Romans 5.1; Eph 2.16 b) Eph 1.10; 1 Jo 2.2]21 And although you were formerly alienated and hostile in mind, engaged in evil deeds,
[21 And to you who were once alienated and enemies according to the mind in the evil works b, a) Eph 2,13 b) Rom 8,7; Eph 2,1-3]22 yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach—
[22 But he has now reconciled A in the body of his flesh a through death b, to make you holy and impeccable and impenetrable c, A) o. the fullness of <the deity>; see. V. 19 a) Eph 2.15 b) Rom 5.10; 1 Peter 3.18 c) Eph 1.4]23 if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard, which was proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, was made a minister.
[23 Provided that you are founded and firm in faith and do not let yourself be carried away from the hope of the gospel a that you have heard, that has been preached in all of creation b under heaven c, whose servant I, Paul, have become. a) 1 Cor 15.2; 1Thes 1.3 b) Mk 16.15 c) V. 6]
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Heb 1,2
2 in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world.
[2 at the end of these days he spoke to us in the son Aa, whom he used to inherit all things b, through whom he also made worlds B; A) i.e. in the person of the son, for whose uniqueness the missing article in Greek. significant is B) o. the ages, o. the eternities; Greek eons a) Mt 14.33 b) Ps 2.8; Mt 21,37.38 c) V. 10; Joh 1,3]
According to my belief, the incarnation should be seen further. From personal experience, I believe in reincarnation. This has nothing to do with the question of whether Jesus was GOD or not. It can also be justified with the Bible:
In my diary of November 26, 2011, I wrote down:
“How is it with reincarnation again? From home, I was completely taught against it. Rudolf Steiner, founder of anthroposophy, a famous proponent of reincarnation, was rejected by my parents. I can understand that, since this man described Judaism as a mistake in history and rejected the belief in rebirth. Hasidic Jews for their part are firmly convinced of the reality of reincarnation. Jesus apparently also believed in it, otherwise he could not have called John the Baptist, Elijah (Matthew 11:14 and Matthew 17: 10-13 and Mark 9: 11-13).
With this entry in the diary I became aware of the clear distinction between reincarnation and rebirth. I have my personal experiences with both. I have described my rebirth in the accountability report after the “apprenticeship” 1.2. and also discussed with my former teacher. (April 23, 2008; Nicodemus with Jesus. (John 3: 1 ff.)) What happened at that time in 1980 penetrated very deeply into me.
I had experience of reincarnation especially in one of my psychotic episodes. Back then, as a patient in the clinic, I saw myself spiritually next to people I knew, everyone in their cycle. They were actually ellipses with high and low points. The highlight in my ellipse was like being absorbed by the sun, or the culmination point of a human copulation. The low point was depression in the truest sense of the word, or being washed away by a toilet facility.
Belief is in demand and I notice how superstition always wants to interfere. There is still a small residual cloud in the sky. Father I think help my unbelief! I crouch on the floor and make myself aware of the fact of salvation: Jesus died for me on the cross and opened the way to the Father. The blood of Jesus has flowed for me too! Jesus made the ultimate sacrifice.
As I sit up, the last little cloud has disappeared in the sky! Hallelujah! Signs and wonders! ”
In addition to the scriptures specified in the diary entry, I would also like to point out the following that can promote understanding of reincarnation:
(Source: New American Standard Bible (NASB))
First:
Matthew 16: 13-17:
13 Now when Jesus came into the district of Caesarea Philippi, He was asking His disciples, “Who do people say that the Son of Man is?”
[13 When Jesus came to the areas of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples and said, What do people say who is the Son of Man? a) Jn 12:34]
14 And they said, “Some say John the Baptist; and others, Elijah; but still others, Jeremiah, or one of the prophets.”
[14 And they said, Some: John the Baptist; others: Elijah; and others again: Jeremiah or one of the prophets a. a) Chap. 14.2; 17.10; Mk 6,14.15]
15 He *said to them, “But who do you say that I am?”
[15 He said to them, But what do you say who I am?]
16 Simon Peter answered, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”
[16 Simon Peter answered and said, You are the Christ, the son of the living God a. a) Chap. 14.33; John 6.69; 1 Jo 4.15]
17 And Jesus said to him, “Blessed are you, Simon Barjona, because flesh and blood did not reveal this to you, but My Father who is in heaven.
[17 And Jesus answered and said to him, Blessed are you, Simon, Bar Jonah Aa; because flesh and blood did not reveal it to you, but my father who is in heaven b. A) i.e. Son Jonas a) Joh 1,42 b) Gal 1,15.16]
At the time of Jesus, the idea of reincarnation seemed to be common. Hence the question of Jesus, whom people think of him. In response he got: all deceased people. It is known that the Pharisees believed in the resurrection, but not the Sadducees, who no longer exist.
Second:
Mark 6, 14-16:
14 And King Herod heard of it, for His name had become well known; and people were saying, “John the Baptist has risen from the dead, and that is why these miraculous powers are at work in Him.”
[14 And King Herod Aa heard <of him> – because his name had become known – and they said B: John the Baptist was raised from the dead, and therefore the miraculous powers work in him. A) Herod Antipas, son of Herod’d.Gr., under Roman sovereignty Prince of Galilee and Peräa (4 BC – 39 AD) B) according to other manuscripts: and said a) Lk 3.1]
15 But others were saying, “He is Elijah.” And others were saying, “He is a prophet, like one of the prophets of old.”
[15 Others said, It is Elijah; but others said: <It is> a prophet like one of the prophets a. a) Chap. 8.28; Times 3.23]
16 But when Herod heard of it, he kept saying, “John, whom I beheaded, has risen!”
[16 But when Herod heard it, he said, John whom I beheaded has been raised.]
Third:
Mark 8, 27-29:
27 Jesus went out, along with His disciples, to the villages of Caesarea Philippi; and on the way He questioned His disciples, saying to them, “Who do people say that I am?”
[27 And Jesus and his disciples went out to the villages of Caesarea Philippi. And on the way he asked his disciples and said to them: What do people say who I am?]
28 They told Him, saying, “John the Baptist; and others say Elijah; but others, one of the prophets.”
[28 And they answered him and said, John the Baptist; and others: Elijah; others: one of the prophets a. a) Chap. 6.14.15]
29 And He continued by questioning them, “But who do you say that I am?” Peter *answered and *said to Him, “You are [a]the Christ.”
[29 And he asked her, but what do you say who I am? Peter answers and says to him: You are the Christ a. a) Joh 1.41; 1Jo 5.1]
Fourth:
Mark 9, 11-13:
11 They asked Him, saying, “Why is it that the scribes say that Elijah must come first?”
[11 And they asked him, saying, Why do the scribes say that Elijah must come first? a) Luke 1.17]
12 And He said to them, “Elijah does first come and restore all things. And yet how is it written of the Son of Man that He will suffer many things and be treated with contempt?
[12 And he said to them, Elijah comes first and restores all things. And how is it written about the Son of Man? That he should suffer a lot and be despised b. a) times 3.23 b) Isa 53.3]
13 But I say to you that Elijah has [a]indeed come, and they did to him whatever they wished, just as it is written of him.”
[13 But I tell you, Elijah also came a, and they did him what they wanted b, and it is written about him c. a) Mt 11:14 b) Chap. 6.28 c) 1Ki 19.2.10]
Fifth:
Luke 1:17:
17 It is he who will go as a forerunner before Him in the spirit and power of Elijah, to turn the hearts of the fathers back to the children, and the disobedient to the attitude of the righteous, so as to make ready a people prepared for the Lord.”
[17 And he will go before him a in the spirit and power of Elijah b to convert the hearts of the fathers to the children c and disobedient to the righteous to give the Lord a prepared people. a) V. 76; Cape. 7.27; Times 3.1 b) Mt 11.14 c) times 3.24 d) V. 77]
Here the “reincarnation” consists of spirit and strength.
Sixth:
Luke 9, 18-20:
18 And it happened that while He was praying alone, the disciples were with Him, and He questioned them, saying, “Who do the [a]people say that I am?”
[18 And when he prayed for himself a, the disciples were with him; and he asked her and said, What do the crowds say who I am? a) Chap. 5.16]
19 They answered and said, “John the Baptist, and others say Elijah; but others, that one of the prophets of old has risen again.”
[19 And they answered and said, John the Baptist; others: Elijah; others, however, that one of the old prophets had risen a. a) V. 7.8]
20 And He said to them, “But who do you say that I am?” And Peter answered and said, “The Christ of God.”
[20 And he said to them, but what do you say who I am? Peter answered and said: The Christ of God a. a) Jn 6:69]
Recorded several times.
Seventh:
John 1, 21:
21 They asked him, “What then? Are you Elijah?” And he *said, “I am not.” “Are you the Prophet?” And he answered, “No.”
[21 And they asked him, What then? Are you Elijah a And he says: it’s not me Are you the prophet b? And he replied: No. a) Mt 11:14 b) Chap. 6.14; 7.40; Deut 18,15.18]
To be honest, it must be said that Johannes did not see himself as Elijah. But that doesn’t invalidate the other scriptures.